An Interview with Michael Mann
Michael Mann (Joshua Yospyn)
Janis B. Petzel, MD
In June, I had the opportunity to interview author and researcher Michael Mann, after he gave a fascinating talk on the science of climate change, hosted by the Historical Society in my hometown, Islesboro, Maine. He covered material in his most recent book, Our Fragile Moment, How Lessons from Earth’s Past Can Help Us Survive the Climate Crisis, which I recommend to you for its reasoned and readable approach to the evidence for climate models and the science of climate change.
Dr. Mann is the presidential distinguished professor and director of the Center for Science, Sustainability and the Media at the University of Pennsylvania. He is an elected member of the U.S. National Academy of Sciences, among his many other awards and honors. His other books include The New Climate War; and the Hockey Stick and the Climate Wars.
G.E.T.: Your book, Our Fragile Moment, is a very different take on the science of climate change, tied together with other scientific models that impacted the discussion on climate, such as paleogeology, the Ice Ages, and the risk of Nuclear Winter, plus music from The Police (Walking in Your Footsteps)! Where did you get the idea to go back in geological time to look for clues and confirmations about our current climate situation?
Michael Mann: First of all, paleoclimate—the study of Earth’s past climate changes and what we can learn from them –is really where I started out, when I was a young post-doctoral researcher back in the late 1990s (the “hockey stick” work I mentioned). I have since written much about the science and politics about climate change, but I wanted to get back to my scientific roots, and looking at Earth’s climate history was a way to do that.
Secondly, I have in recent years increasingly seen the topic of paleoclimate misrepresented by climate doomers, who claim that it somehow supports the notion it is no longer possible for us to avert catastrophic warming. I wanted to correct the record on that. But in the process, I realized there are so many interesting stories to tell that have a bearing on us and our civilization today, and in the end, that was really my aim, to tell those stories and, in the process, make readers informed and empowered to act.
G.E.T.: How did you get interested in writing about climate change in the first place?
MM: I found myself in the center of the contentious debate over human-caused climate change during the late 1990s after my co-authors and I published the now-iconic “Hockey Stick” curve, which demonstrates the unprecedented nature of the warming of the industrial era caused by fossil fuel burning and carbon pollution. I ultimately decided to use the platform that publication provided me to educate the public and policymakers, as best I could, about the existential threat posed by our continued reliance of fossil fuels. I have written about everything from the fundamental basic science to the sociopolitical dimensions of the climate crisis. Our Fragile Moment touches on each of these matters.
G.E.T.: Does your research overlap with your writing?
MM: Yes, I continue to perform and advise research on everything from the fundamental physical science of climate to the science of communication. Among my most recent scientific articles are studies seeking to understand the details of the coming and going of the ice ages of the past several million years, the relationship between climate change and extreme weather events, and particularly relevant given this year’s unusually active hurricane season, the impact that climate change is having on the intensity of hurricanes. All my articles can be found online at https://michaelmann.net/content/published-articles.
I also write op-eds and commentaries for the popular press and do numerous media interviews aimed at educating the public about the science and its implications. These can be found at https://michaelmann.net/news.
G.E.T.: You have said something along the lines of reality is bad enough, we do not have to exaggerate the dangers of climate change.
MM: Yes, I quote my friend and mentor who is sadly no longer with us, the great Stephen Schneider, who would often say, in response to those who exaggerate the science for the purpose of drawing attention to the climate crisis, that “the truth is bad enough.” Any objective assessment of the devastating impacts climate change is already having is more than ample basis for urgent action.
G.E.T.: What do you see as the risk of exaggeration and panic when it comes to public perception of climate change?
MM: As I like to say, there is urgency, but there is agency too. The problem of doom and despair messaging is that they potentially lead to disengagement. If it is truly too late to act, then why bother? Bad actors—polluters and petrostates like Russia, understand that and have been fanning the flames of doomism.
The truth, however, is that that it is not too late to prevent the worst impacts of climate change.
This is a major theme of my book, i.e. that an objective review of the lessons that Earth’s long-term history provides us with the knowledge that the worst consequences can be avoided if we take immediate action. We must rapidly decarbonize our civilization. Fortunately, the obstacles—as I discuss in the book—are not physical or technological. They are political. And political obstacles can be overcome.
G.E.T.: Do you have suggestions for what the average person do to take action to fight climate change?
MM: Vote, vote, vote. And make sure everyone else you know does. While we should all do whatever we can do to minimize our own environmental impact, we need policies and incentives that will lead everyone to engage in climate-friendly actions. And the only way we get that is by voting for politicians who will represent us and our interests rather than the special interests. We must use our voice and our vote to help elect climate-forward politicians and vote out politicians in the hip pocket of polluters.
G.E.T.: What is your next project?
MM: I am working on a book with vaccine scientist Peter Hotez entitled Science Under Siege, about the parallels between the increasing attacks on public health scientists like Peter and Tony Fauci, and the attacks that climate scientists like me have endured over the past few decades. There is now a concerted effort by bad actors—politicians, petrostates, polluters, plutocrats, and propagandists, to poison our public discourse, and lead us astray when it comes to the great crisis we currently face—is the climate crisis, and global pandemics like COVID—to advance a partisan political agenda. It threatens both us and the planet, and we felt we had to speak out before it is too late to act.
G.E.T.: Any suggestions on how to keep moving in a healthy direction on climate response even if politics in the U.S. looks bleak?
MM: Vote, organize, and speak out in the months ahead like the future of our planet depends on it. Because it does.
Janis Petzel, MD is a physician, grandmother and climate activist whose writing focuses on resilience, climate, and health. She lives in Islesboro, Maine where she advocates and acts for a fossil-fuel free future. She serves on the Islesboro Energy Team and is a Climate Ambassador for Physicians for Social Responsibility.
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